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Thread: Why not thaw at room temp?

  1. #1
    Sqwertz Guest

    Default Why not thaw at room temp?

    I just put a 5lb chunk each of fatty pork and beef brisket deckle
    (leftover from corning the flat) in the unused side of the kitchen
    sink to thaw overnight. They're each wrapped separately in gallon
    Ziplocs and have a layer of heavy duty foil over top of them. I'll
    be making sausage tomorrow.

    They'll probably still be frozen in the center tomorrow morning, and
    the temp of the outside of the meat will not be above 40F - probably
    closer to 33F because things like this thaw pretty evenly.

    So why is it recommended you not thaw something like this at room
    temp? Are they referring to smaller pieces of meat that may have
    parts that get above 40F? I do this all the time. I will of course
    check them around 4:00am just to be sure they're not thawing too
    fast.

    -sw

  2. #2
    Kris Guest

    Default Re: Why not thaw at room temp?

    On Mar 14, 9:56*pm, Sqwertz <swe...@cluemail.compost> wrote:
    > I just put a 5lb chunk each of fatty pork and beef brisket deckle
    > (leftover from corning the flat) in the unused side of the kitchen
    > sink to thaw overnight. *They're each wrapped separately in gallon
    > Ziplocs and have a layer of heavy duty foil over top of them. *I'll
    > be making sausage tomorrow.
    >
    > They'll probably still be frozen in the center tomorrow morning, and
    > the temp of the outside of the meat will not be above 40F - probably
    > closer to 33F because things like this thaw pretty evenly.
    >
    > So why is it recommended you not thaw something like this at room
    > temp? *Are they referring to smaller pieces of meat that may have
    > parts that get above 40F? *I do this all the time. *I will of course
    > check them around 4:00am just to be sure they're not thawing too
    > fast.
    >
    > -sw


    Well, I admit I'll thaw big hunks of meat that way too sometimes.
    Never has been a problem.

    I suppose "they" always have to advise against it in *case* there's a
    chance of it getting too warm and being a potential problem. Caution
    always has a place in food safety, I guess.

    Kris

  3. #3
    DK Guest

    Default Re: Why not thaw at room temp?

    Sqwertz wrote:
    > I just put a 5lb chunk each of fatty pork and beef brisket deckle
    > (leftover from corning the flat) in the unused side of the kitchen
    > sink to thaw overnight. They're each wrapped separately in gallon
    > Ziplocs and have a layer of heavy duty foil over top of them. I'll
    > be making sausage tomorrow.
    >
    > They'll probably still be frozen in the center tomorrow morning, and
    > the temp of the outside of the meat will not be above 40F - probably
    > closer to 33F because things like this thaw pretty evenly.
    >
    > So why is it recommended you not thaw something like this at room
    > temp? Are they referring to smaller pieces of meat that may have
    > parts that get above 40F? I do this all the time. I will of course
    > check them around 4:00am just to be sure they're not thawing too
    > fast.
    >
    > -sw


    I have thawed brisket and other large pieces of meat the same way -
    several layers of foil overnight and it's still very cold in the AM. It
    would take days in the refrigerator.

    -dk

  4. #4
    Bigbazza Guest

    Default Re: Why not thaw at room temp?


    "Sqwertz" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]..
    >I just put a 5lb chunk each of fatty pork and beef brisket deckle
    > (leftover from corning the flat) in the unused side of the kitchen
    > sink to thaw overnight. They're each wrapped separately in gallon
    > Ziplocs and have a layer of heavy duty foil over top of them. I'll
    > be making sausage tomorrow.
    >
    > They'll probably still be frozen in the center tomorrow morning, and
    > the temp of the outside of the meat will not be above 40F - probably
    > closer to 33F because things like this thaw pretty evenly.
    >
    > So why is it recommended you not thaw something like this at room
    > temp? Are they referring to smaller pieces of meat that may have
    > parts that get above 40F? I do this all the time. I will of course
    > check them around 4:00am just to be sure they're not thawing too
    > fast.
    >
    > -sw



    I don't usually know what I am going to cook that night for dinner,
    SW....This is attributed to 3 things.... Laziness, Forgetfulness and not
    knowing if my son is dinning in or out for the night.... I can't be too much
    bothered just cooking a meal for myself quite often, so I will then get
    something out that is quick and easy..Sometimes I will forgo my meal
    even....

    So, when I think I know if he will be in for dinner or not, I will take the
    selected larger pieces like 'Roasts' and just give them a small dose of
    microwaves, enough not to heat up ... I then roll it in foil and leave out
    for an hour or so and then put into the fridge.....The same with chops and
    steaks...I will give them a quick zap in the latter part of the afternoon,
    then wrap in foil and put back into the fridge....Always OK....If I do this
    'closer' to meal time (chops or steak) I will zap and foil wrap and leave
    out for an hour or so...

    Bigbazza (Barry) Oz


  5. #5
    Janet Wilder Guest

    Default Re: Why not thaw at room temp?

    Sqwertz wrote:

    > So why is it recommended you not thaw something like this at room
    > temp? Are they referring to smaller pieces of meat that may have
    > parts that get above 40F? I do this all the time. I will of course
    > check them around 4:00am just to be sure they're not thawing too
    > fast.



    I don't know who "they" are. I thaw stuff at room temperature all the
    time. My mother did, too. None of us got sick from it. We learned to do
    this before the food police became popular.


    --
    Janet Wilder
    Way-the-heck-south-Texas

  6. #6
    Sqwertz Guest

    Default Re: Why not thaw at room temp?

    Janet Wilder <[email protected]> wrote:

    > Sqwertz wrote:
    >
    >> So why is it recommended you not thaw something like this at room
    >> temp? Are they referring to smaller pieces of meat that may have
    >> parts that get above 40F? I do this all the time. I will of course
    >> check them around 4:00am just to be sure they're not thawing too
    >> fast.

    >
    > I don't know who "they" are.


    The USDA, and every health inspection/enforcement agency in the
    nation.

    -sw

  7. #7
    Janet Wilder Guest

    Default Re: Why not thaw at room temp?

    Sqwertz wrote:
    > Janet Wilder <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >> Sqwertz wrote:
    >>
    >>> So why is it recommended you not thaw something like this at room
    >>> temp? Are they referring to smaller pieces of meat that may have
    >>> parts that get above 40F? I do this all the time. I will of course
    >>> check them around 4:00am just to be sure they're not thawing too
    >>> fast.

    >> I don't know who "they" are.

    >
    > The USDA, and every health inspection/enforcement agency in the
    > nation.
    >
    > -sw


    The food police. Just as I suspected. Maybe those rules are more
    important in commercial applications. It hasn't made any difference in
    my home kitchen.

    --
    Janet Wilder
    Way-the-heck-south-Texas

  8. #8
    Bigbazza Guest

    Default Re: Why not thaw at room temp?


    "Janet Wilder" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:0004e8a3$0$2129$[email protected]..
    > Sqwertz wrote:
    >
    >> So why is it recommended you not thaw something like this at room
    >> temp? Are they referring to smaller pieces of meat that may have
    >> parts that get above 40F? I do this all the time. I will of course
    >> check them around 4:00am just to be sure they're not thawing too
    >> fast.

    >
    >
    > I don't know who "they" are. I thaw stuff at room temperature all the
    > time. My mother did, too. None of us got sick from it. We learned to do
    > this before the food police became popular.
    >
    >
    > --
    > Janet Wilder
    > Way-the-heck-south-Texas




    Whilst I don't make a habit of it, I have sometimes accidentally left
    something frozen out overnight, or intended to cook it earlier next day....I
    have never had problems with that either.... Janet....

    Bigbazza (Barry) Oz


  9. #9
    Dimitri Guest

    Default Re: Why not thaw at room temp?


    "Sqwertz" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]..
    >I just put a 5lb chunk each of fatty pork and beef brisket deckle
    > (leftover from corning the flat) in the unused side of the kitchen
    > sink to thaw overnight. They're each wrapped separately in gallon
    > Ziplocs and have a layer of heavy duty foil over top of them. I'll
    > be making sausage tomorrow.
    >
    > They'll probably still be frozen in the center tomorrow morning, and
    > the temp of the outside of the meat will not be above 40F - probably
    > closer to 33F because things like this thaw pretty evenly.
    >
    > So why is it recommended you not thaw something like this at room
    > temp? Are they referring to smaller pieces of meat that may have
    > parts that get above 40F? I do this all the time. I will of course
    > check them around 4:00am just to be sure they're not thawing too
    > fast.
    >
    > -sw


    There are several considerations when thawing meat:

    It is a fact that water freezes faster than tissue, During the freezing the
    ice separates from the tissue, the though is when thawing at room
    temperature the ice crystals within the meat do not have time to be
    reabsorbed into the flesh/tissue\.

    Secondly, the food DANGER ZONE is considered to be above 40 degrees. It is
    possible to have the outer layer of the meat at over 40 degrees and this an
    promote the growth of unwanted bacteria.

    This leads us back to the technique of tempering - defrosting in the fridge.

    Dimitri


  10. #10
    Leonard Blaisdell Guest

    Default Re: Why not thaw at room temp?

    In article <[email protected]>,
    Sqwertz <[email protected]> wrote:

    > So why is it recommended you not thaw something like this at room
    > temp? Are they referring to smaller pieces of meat that may have
    > parts that get above 40F? I do this all the time. I will of course
    > check them around 4:00am just to be sure they're not thawing too
    > fast.


    It's so people who would normally win the Darwin Award are protected
    from their own forgetfulness. We told you so! Have you bought a ladder
    lately? All the danger stickers adhere to my shoes and impede my upward
    progress.

    leo

  11. #11
    Omelet Guest

    Default Re: Why not thaw at room temp?

    In article <[email protected]>,
    Sqwertz <[email protected]> wrote:

    > I just put a 5lb chunk each of fatty pork and beef brisket deckle
    > (leftover from corning the flat) in the unused side of the kitchen
    > sink to thaw overnight. They're each wrapped separately in gallon
    > Ziplocs and have a layer of heavy duty foil over top of them. I'll
    > be making sausage tomorrow.
    >
    > They'll probably still be frozen in the center tomorrow morning, and
    > the temp of the outside of the meat will not be above 40F - probably
    > closer to 33F because things like this thaw pretty evenly.
    >
    > So why is it recommended you not thaw something like this at room
    > temp? Are they referring to smaller pieces of meat that may have
    > parts that get above 40F? I do this all the time. I will of course
    > check them around 4:00am just to be sure they're not thawing too
    > fast.
    >
    > -sw


    I've thawed at room temp for years on many cuts of meat. So long as it's
    monitored in a reasonable fashion, I see no reason to do it.

    I've yet to "rot" any meat.
    --
    Peace! Om

    I find hope in the darkest of days, and focus in the brightest. I do not judge the universe. -- Dalai Lama

  12. #12
    Sqwertz Guest

    Default Re: Why not thaw at room temp?

    Omelet <[email protected]> wrote:

    > In article <[email protected]>,
    > Sqwertz <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >> The USDA, and every health inspection/enforcement agency in the
    >> nation.

    >
    > And they are going to tell ME how to thaw my food...
    >
    > How?


    Felling a little confrontational tonight, eh? :-)

    -sw

  13. #13
    Omelet Guest

    Default Re: Why not thaw at room temp?

    In article <[email protected]>,
    Sqwertz <[email protected]> wrote:

    > Janet Wilder <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > > Sqwertz wrote:
    > >
    > >> So why is it recommended you not thaw something like this at room
    > >> temp? Are they referring to smaller pieces of meat that may have
    > >> parts that get above 40F? I do this all the time. I will of course
    > >> check them around 4:00am just to be sure they're not thawing too
    > >> fast.

    > >
    > > I don't know who "they" are.

    >
    > The USDA, and every health inspection/enforcement agency in the
    > nation.
    >
    > -sw


    And they are going to tell ME how to thaw my food...

    How?
    --
    Peace! Om

    I find hope in the darkest of days, and focus in the brightest. I do not judge the universe. -- Dalai Lama

  14. #14
    Victor Sack Guest

    Default Re: Why not thaw at room temp?

    Sqwertz <[email protected]> wrote:

    > So why is it recommended you not thaw something like this at room
    > temp?


    Here is an interesting link:
    <http://www.hi-tm.com/Documents/Thaw-counter.html>.

    Victor

  15. #15
    James Silverton Guest

    Default Re: Why not thaw at room temp?

    Kris wrote on Sat, 14 Mar 2009 19:03:40 -0700 (PDT):

    > On Mar 14, 9:56 pm, Sqwertz <swe...@cluemail.compost> wrote:
    >> I just put a 5lb chunk each of fatty pork and beef brisket
    >> deckle (leftover from corning the flat) in the unused side of
    >> the kitchen sink to thaw overnight. They're each wrapped
    >> separately in gallon Ziplocs and have a layer of heavy duty
    >> foil over top of them. I'll be making sausage tomorrow.
    >>
    >> They'll probably still be frozen in the center tomorrow
    >> morning, and the temp of the outside of the meat will not be
    >> above 40F - probably closer to 33F because things like this
    >> thaw pretty evenly.
    >>
    >> So why is it recommended you not thaw something like this at
    >> room temp? Are they referring to smaller pieces of meat that
    >> may have parts that get above 40F? I do this all the time.
    >> I will of course check them around 4:00am just to be sure
    >> they're not thawing too fast.
    >>
    >> -sw


    > Well, I admit I'll thaw big hunks of meat that way too
    > sometimes. Never has been a problem.


    > I suppose "they" always have to advise against it in *case*
    > there's a chance of it getting too warm and being a potential
    > problem. Caution always has a place in food safety, I guess.


    Recent news seems to support that. The Fat Duck did not afflict people
    with food poisoning for many years.

    --

    James Silverton
    Potomac, Maryland

    Email, with obvious alterations: not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not


  16. #16
    Omelet Guest

    Default Re: Why not thaw at room temp?

    In article <[email protected]>,
    Sqwertz <[email protected]> wrote:

    > Omelet <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > > In article <[email protected]>,
    > > Sqwertz <[email protected]> wrote:
    > >
    > >> The USDA, and every health inspection/enforcement agency in the
    > >> nation.

    > >
    > > And they are going to tell ME how to thaw my food...
    > >
    > > How?

    >
    > Felling a little confrontational tonight, eh? :-)
    >
    > -sw


    It's been a rough week dear.
    --
    Peace! Om

    I find hope in the darkest of days, and focus in the brightest. I do not judge the universe. -- Dalai Lama

  17. #17
    cshenk Guest

    Default Re: Why not thaw at room temp?

    "Sqwertz" wrote

    >I just put a 5lb chunk each of fatty pork and beef brisket deckle
    > (leftover from corning the flat) in the unused side of the kitchen
    > sink to thaw overnight. They're each wrapped separately in gallon


    Add cold water to the sink (make sure it's in a watertight wrapping). It
    will defrost faster and safer! I acutally use a large pot in the sink for
    this.



  18. #18
    Michael \Dog3\ Guest

    Default Re: Why not thaw at room temp?

    Sqwertz <[email protected]> news:140309.205643rfc1986.295
    @sqwertz.com: in rec.food.cooking

    > I just put a 5lb chunk each of fatty pork and beef brisket deckle
    > (leftover from corning the flat) in the unused side of the kitchen
    > sink to thaw overnight. They're each wrapped separately in gallon
    > Ziplocs and have a layer of heavy duty foil over top of them. I'll
    > be making sausage tomorrow.
    >
    > They'll probably still be frozen in the center tomorrow morning, and
    > the temp of the outside of the meat will not be above 40F - probably
    > closer to 33F because things like this thaw pretty evenly.
    >
    > So why is it recommended you not thaw something like this at room
    > temp? Are they referring to smaller pieces of meat that may have
    > parts that get above 40F? I do this all the time. I will of course
    > check them around 4:00am just to be sure they're not thawing too
    > fast.


    Generally with a large piece of meat like that I'll know in advance and
    will usually thaw it in the refrigerator. I do thaw things at room temp
    from time to time and sometimes I'll put the meat in a baggie or
    something similar and thaw it in the sink under cold running water. I've
    never gotten sick by thawing at room temp. My mother used to thaw at
    room temp all the time and none of us ever got sick. I'm sure that doing
    it in a commercial kitchen is forbidden but I've never had a problem with
    it. I *do* prefer thawing in the fridge.

    Michael


    --
    “He who does not understand your silence will probably not understand
    your words.”
    ~Elbert Hubbard

    You can find me at: - michael at lonergan dot us dot com

  19. #19
    JT January Guest

    Default Re: Why not thaw at room temp?

    On Sun, 15 Mar 2009 12:35:43 GMT, James Silverton wrote:

    > Recent news seems to support that. The Fat Dick did not afflict people
    > with food poisoning for many years.


    You seem to have this obsession with fat dicks.

  20. #20
    Sqwertz Guest

    Default Re: Why not thaw at room temp?

    cshenk <[email protected]> wrote:

    > "Sqwertz" wrote
    >
    >>I just put a 5lb chunk each of fatty pork and beef brisket deckle
    >> (leftover from corning the flat) in the unused side of the kitchen
    >> sink to thaw overnight. They're each wrapped separately in gallon

    >
    > Add cold water to the sink (make sure it's in a watertight wrapping). It
    > will defrost faster and safer! I acutally use a large pot in the sink for
    > this.


    It may thaw quicker, but it thaws unevenly. In this case, the
    outside of the meat will be much warmer than the inside. I'd rather
    thaw slowly at room temp and have the meat still very cold all the
    way through.[

    -sw

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