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Thread: cshenk: need help!

  1. #1
    notbob Guest

    Default cshenk: need help!

    did a french bread loaf. A brick!

    nb

  2. #2
    PeterL Guest

    Default Re: cshenk: need help!

    notbob <[email protected]> wrote in news:2dD1m.509$[email protected]:

    > did a french bread loaf. A brick!
    >
    > nb
    >




    Throw it through someones window!!



    --
    Peter Lucas
    Brisbane
    Australia

    "As viscous as motor oil swirled in a swamp, redolent of burnt bell peppers
    nested in by incontinent mice and a finish reminiscent of the dregs of a
    stale can of Coca-Cola that someone has been using as an ashtray. Not a bad
    drink, though."
    Excerpt from "The Moose Turd Wine Tasting" by T. A. Nonymous

  3. #3
    cshenk Guest

    Default Re: cshenk: need help!

    "notbob" wrote

    > did a french bread loaf. A brick!


    Ok, lets go over the recipe you used? I'll post my normal one and detail
    out the steps. Note mine is adapted a bit and not a true 'french' but it's
    very good and a reliable one.

    If you can post the one you used, assuming it wasnt mine (grin), I'll
    probably see what's wrong.


    MMMMM----- Recipe via Meal-Master (tm) v8.05

    Title: French Bread, xxcarol's favorite
    Categories: Breadmaker, Cheap, Xxcarol
    Yield: 1 Servings

    1 1/4 c Water
    1 1/2 tb Butter

    These are simple and not apt to be the problem unless you are using a
    european 'cup' vice a USA measure one. A standard measure set soold in the
    USA if what you likely have so this isnt gonna be it. The butter can be a
    little off and it will be ok. The butter should be cut to smallish slices,
    about 6 for that amount.

    If your machine recommended 'room temp' for all things, you can either cut
    this when cold (easier to get the right amount) then let it sit about 30
    mins, or you can load the whole machine's ingredients and let it wait about
    30 mins before turning on.

    None of my machines have cared about this but my cuisinart *says* it cares.

    3 1/2 c White flour

    This may be it. In fact, this recipe is designed for hose of us who only
    fluff the flour a little and pretty much 'scoup'. If you 'fluffed then
    spooned it' then the recipe would call for 4 cups of flour? Maybe 3 3/4.
    Also your type of flour has a big impact. Look for a bag of 'Better for
    Bread' if you used other. I'm on a big bag of 'King Arthur' flour which is
    also a good one. Breadmachines are very tempermental about low-protien
    'regular flour'.

    1 tb Dry milk

    This is actually optional but i like the effect.

    2 tb Sugar
    1 1/2 ts Salt
    2 ts Yeast

    These go on top an are measured with a level spoon. Not a time to do it by
    'eye' here. The ratio is very important. Unlike hand mixed and shaped
    breads, a machine needs a known measure.

    If you have a rapid acting dry yeast or 'breadmakers yeast' (both are
    identical as far as I can tell) then check the expiration date. You can
    also 'proof' some of it in a little water. It should bubble up a bit in 1/2
    cup water with a little sugar. Takes about 30 mins I am told. Try a fresh
    packet (sold in strips of 3) if you have a jar and think it may have been
    mis-handled so be 'bad'. To keep yeast, keep it in th fridge. In fact, I
    freeze it in 1 lb bags and pour off some to the fleishman's yeast jar as it
    runs down.

    Set the breadmaker to French and a 2 lb loaf. Try 'medium crust' at the
    start and once you have that working, you will know if you want a lighter
    crust or a darker one.

    Origin unknown but xxcarol's addition is to add herbs or minced
    garlic.

    MMMMM




  4. #4
    aem Guest

    Default Re: cshenk: need help!

    On Jun 28, 7:04*am, "cshenk" <cshe...@cox.net> wrote:
    > "notbob" wrote
    >
    > > did a french bread loaf. * A brick!

    >
    > Ok, lets go over the recipe you used? *I'll post my normal one and detail
    > out the steps. *Note mine is adapted a bit and not a true 'french' but it's
    > very good and a reliable one.
    >
    > If you can post the one you used, assuming it wasnt mine (grin), I'll
    > probably see what's wrong.
    >
    > MMMMM----- Recipe via Meal-Master (tm) v8.05
    >
    > * * * Title: French Bread, xxcarol's favorite
    > *Categories: Breadmaker, Cheap, Xxcarol
    > * * * Yield: 1 Servings
    >
    > * 1 1/4 c *Water
    > * 1 1/2 tb Butter
    >
    > These are simple and not apt to be the problem unless you are using a
    > european 'cup' vice a USA measure one. *A standard measure set soold inthe
    > USA if what you likely have so this isnt gonna be it. *The butter can be a
    > little off and it will be ok. *The butter should be cut to smallish slices,
    > about 6 for that amount.
    >
    > If your machine recommended 'room temp' for all things, you can either cut
    > this when cold (easier to get the right amount) then let it sit about 30
    > mins, or you can load the whole machine's ingredients and let it wait about
    > 30 mins before turning on.
    >
    > None of my machines have cared about this but my cuisinart *says* it cares.
    >
    > * 3 1/2 c *White flour
    >
    > This may be it. *In fact, this recipe is designed for hose of us who only
    > fluff the flour a little and pretty much 'scoup'. *If you 'fluffed then
    > spooned it' then the recipe would call for 4 cups of flour? *Maybe 3 3/4.
    > Also your type of flour has a big impact. *Look for a bag of 'Better for
    > Bread' if you used other. *I'm on a big bag of 'King Arthur' flour which is
    > also a good one. *Breadmachines are very tempermental about low-protien
    > 'regular flour'.
    >
    > * * * 1 tb Dry milk
    >
    > This is actually optional but i like the effect.
    >
    > * * * 2 tb Sugar
    > * 1 1/2 ts Salt
    > * * * 2 ts Yeast

    [snip the rest]

    Maybe I've come in late on a prior discussion, but if he's trying to
    make French bread, your recipe is not the answer. French bread
    contains flour, water, salt and yeast. Milk or milk powder and sugar
    turn it into ordinary white bread. That can be fine, but it ain't
    French bread. In my limited experience the crust and crumb of French
    bread are difficult to impossible to achieve in the bread machine.
    Best results I had were to make the dough in the machine, then remove
    and bake in the oven with a stone and water spritzes. -aem

  5. #5
    Vesper Guest

    Default Re: cshenk: need help!

    On Sun, 28 Jun 2009 09:43:19 -0700 (PDT), aem <[email protected]>
    wrote:

    >On Jun 28, 7:04*am, "cshenk" <cshe...@cox.net> wrote:
    >> "notbob" wrote
    >>
    >> > did a french bread loaf. * A brick!

    >>
    >> Ok, lets go over the recipe you used? *I'll post my normal one and detail
    >> out the steps. *Note mine is adapted a bit and not a true 'french' but it's
    >> very good and a reliable one.
    >>
    >> If you can post the one you used, assuming it wasnt mine (grin), I'll
    >> probably see what's wrong.
    >>
    >> MMMMM----- Recipe via Meal-Master (tm) v8.05
    >>
    >> * * * Title: French Bread, xxcarol's favorite
    >> *Categories: Breadmaker, Cheap, Xxcarol
    >> * * * Yield: 1 Servings
    >>
    >> * 1 1/4 c *Water
    >> * 1 1/2 tb Butter
    >>
    >> These are simple and not apt to be the problem unless you are using a
    >> european 'cup' vice a USA measure one. *A standard measure set soold in the
    >> USA if what you likely have so this isnt gonna be it. *The butter can be a
    >> little off and it will be ok. *The butter should be cut to smallish slices,
    >> about 6 for that amount.
    >>
    >> If your machine recommended 'room temp' for all things, you can either cut
    >> this when cold (easier to get the right amount) then let it sit about 30
    >> mins, or you can load the whole machine's ingredients and let it wait about
    >> 30 mins before turning on.
    >>
    >> None of my machines have cared about this but my cuisinart *says* it cares.
    >>
    >> * 3 1/2 c *White flour
    >>
    >> This may be it. *In fact, this recipe is designed for hose of us who only
    >> fluff the flour a little and pretty much 'scoup'. *If you 'fluffed then
    >> spooned it' then the recipe would call for 4 cups of flour? *Maybe 3 3/4.
    >> Also your type of flour has a big impact. *Look for a bag of 'Better for
    >> Bread' if you used other. *I'm on a big bag of 'King Arthur' flour which is
    >> also a good one. *Breadmachines are very tempermental about low-protien
    >> 'regular flour'.
    >>
    >> * * * 1 tb Dry milk
    >>
    >> This is actually optional but i like the effect.
    >>
    >> * * * 2 tb Sugar
    >> * 1 1/2 ts Salt
    >> * * * 2 ts Yeast

    > [snip the rest]
    >
    >Maybe I've come in late on a prior discussion, but if he's trying to
    >make French bread, your recipe is not the answer. French bread
    >contains flour, water, salt and yeast. Milk or milk powder and sugar
    >turn it into ordinary white bread. That can be fine, but it ain't
    >French bread. In my limited experience the crust and crumb of French
    >bread are difficult to impossible to achieve in the bread machine.
    >Best results I had were to make the dough in the machine, then remove
    >and bake in the oven with a stone and water spritzes. -aem




    Water spritzes I get. What's with the stone?

    V

  6. #6
    dsi1 Guest

    Default Re: cshenk: need help!

    aem wrote:
    >
    > Maybe I've come in late on a prior discussion, but if he's trying to
    > make French bread, your recipe is not the answer. French bread
    > contains flour, water, salt and yeast. Milk or milk powder and sugar
    > turn it into ordinary white bread. That can be fine, but it ain't
    > French bread. In my limited experience the crust and crumb of French
    > bread are difficult to impossible to achieve in the bread machine.
    > Best results I had were to make the dough in the machine, then remove
    > and bake in the oven with a stone and water spritzes. -aem


    I wouldn't add any oil or butter if I was making a French or Italian
    loaf either. One of these days, I'm gonna try adding some MSG. :-)

    The addition of wheat gluten helps a lot in getting a very nice crust. I
    don't use the stones. I probably would like the results but I'm too lazy.

  7. #7
    aem Guest

    Default Re: cshenk: need help!

    On Jun 28, 10:02*am, Vesper <tjf...@hotmail.com> wrote:
    >
    > Water spritzes I get. *What's with the stone?
    >

    I replied to this with a link to an interesting breadmaking website
    but it hasn't appeared yet. The site is
    http://www.thefreshloaf[DOT]com/lessons/tentips_2_bakingstone with the
    obvious change. Maybe the post will go through this way. -aem

  8. #8
    sf Guest

    Default Re: cshenk: need help!

    On Sun, 28 Jun 2009 09:43:19 -0700 (PDT), aem <[email protected]>
    wrote:

    >Maybe I've come in late on a prior discussion, but if he's trying to
    >make French bread, your recipe is not the answer. French bread
    >contains flour, water, salt and yeast. Milk or milk powder and sugar
    >turn it into ordinary white bread. That can be fine, but it ain't
    >French bread.


    Agreed. I was lost at "butter". Add an egg and call it brioche.

    --
    I love cooking with wine.
    Sometimes I even put it in the food.

  9. #9
    sf Guest

    Default Re: cshenk: need help!

    On Sun, 28 Jun 2009 12:02:50 -0500, Vesper <[email protected]> wrote:

    >Water spritzes I get. What's with the stone?


    For a crispier bottom crust

    --
    I love cooking with wine.
    Sometimes I even put it in the food.

  10. #10
    cshenk Guest

    Default Re: cshenk: need help!

    "aem" wrote
    "cshenk" <cshe...@cox.net> wrote:
    > "notbob" wrote


    >> > did a french bread loaf. A brick!

    >
    >> Ok, lets go over the recipe you used? I'll post my normal one and detail
    >> out the steps. Note mine is adapted a bit and not a true 'french' but
    >> it's


    > Maybe I've come in late on a prior discussion, but if he's trying to
    > make French bread, your recipe is not the answer. French bread


    Naw, ya just missed the first lineand the first reply line ;-)



  11. #11
    Vesper Guest

    Default Re: cshenk: need help!

    On Sun, 28 Jun 2009 13:01:14 -0700, sf <[email protected]> wrote:

    >On Sun, 28 Jun 2009 09:43:19 -0700 (PDT), aem <[email protected]>
    >wrote:
    >
    >>Maybe I've come in late on a prior discussion, but if he's trying to
    >>make French bread, your recipe is not the answer. French bread
    >>contains flour, water, salt and yeast. Milk or milk powder and sugar
    >>turn it into ordinary white bread. That can be fine, but it ain't
    >>French bread.

    >
    >Agreed. I was lost at "butter". Add an egg and call it brioche.



    Is that what I call French Toast and the Brits call Eggy Bread?

    V

  12. #12
    Vesper Guest

    Default Re: cshenk: need help!

    On Sun, 28 Jun 2009 13:01:56 -0700, sf <[email protected]> wrote:

    >On Sun, 28 Jun 2009 12:02:50 -0500, Vesper <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >>Water spritzes I get. What's with the stone?

    >
    >For a crispier bottom crust



    You mean you place the formed dough on some kind of big stone to bake
    it? Does the stone have to be flat or something? What kind of stone
    is best? Does it work in a campfire? I got some more but I want to
    give you a breather.

    V

  13. #13
    ->Stu Guest

    Default Re: cshenk: need help!

    On Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:13:03 -0500, Vesper <[email protected]> wrote:

    >On Sun, 28 Jun 2009 13:01:56 -0700, sf <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >>On Sun, 28 Jun 2009 12:02:50 -0500, Vesper <[email protected]> wrote:
    >>
    >>>Water spritzes I get. What's with the stone?

    >>
    >>For a crispier bottom crust

    >
    >
    >You mean you place the formed dough on some kind of big stone to bake
    >it? Does the stone have to be flat or something? What kind of stone
    >is best? Does it work in a campfire? I got some more but I want to
    >give you a breather.
    >
    >V


    Pizza stone??

  14. #14
    Melba's Jammin' Guest

    Default Re: cshenk: need help!

    In article <[email protected]>,
    Vesper <[email protected]> wrote:
    > You mean you place the formed dough on some kind of big stone to bake
    > it? Does the stone have to be flat or something? What kind of stone
    > is best? Does it work in a campfire? I got some more but I want to
    > give you a breather.
    >
    > V


    Google "pizza stone." Never mind, read this:
    http://www.recipepizza.com/pizza_stone.htm

    I use 6" square, 1/4" thick unglazed terra cotta tiles. Dirt cheap and
    they work just swell. I use them with Zoe Francois and Jeff Hertzberg's
    "Artisan Bread in 5 Minutes a Day" recipes.

    --
    -Barb, Mother Superior, HOSSSPoJ
    http://web.me.com/barbschaller - good news 4-6-2009
    "Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle."
    -Philo of Alexandria

  15. #15
    Janet Bostwick Guest

    Default Re: cshenk: need help!


    "notbob" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:2dD1m.509$[email protected]..
    > did a french bread loaf. A brick!
    >
    > nb


    A simple question -- how much did you handle it after the first rise? What
    I'm getting at is this. Handle the dough gently. You've spent time
    developing all those nice, soft air bubbles. You've kept the dough warm.
    If you spend a lot of time mashing the dough about on your cool counter to
    get it flat and perfect for rolling into a baguette, you no only squish out
    all the bubbles and make the gas spaces tiny, but you cool the dough
    considerably. Try patting the dough into a rough rectangle and then simply
    rolling it up. Pinch the dough ends to seal. You want to roll snugly
    enough to pull a taut skin over the dough. Get the baguettes onto a pan and
    cover them with a damp towel or something similar.
    Janet



  16. #16
    Vesper Guest

    Default Re: cshenk: need help!

    On Sun, 28 Jun 2009 17:32:31 -0500, Melba's Jammin'
    <[email protected]> wrote:

    >In article <[email protected]>,
    > Vesper <[email protected]> wrote:
    >> You mean you place the formed dough on some kind of big stone to bake
    >> it? Does the stone have to be flat or something? What kind of stone
    >> is best? Does it work in a campfire? I got some more but I want to
    >> give you a breather.
    >>
    >> V

    >
    >Google "pizza stone." Never mind, read this:
    >http://www.recipepizza.com/pizza_stone.htm
    >
    >I use 6" square, 1/4" thick unglazed terra cotta tiles. Dirt cheap and
    >they work just swell. I use them with Zoe Francois and Jeff Hertzberg's
    >"Artisan Bread in 5 Minutes a Day" recipes.



    Thanks. I assume I preheat the tiles in the oven and then put the
    dough on them.

    V

  17. #17
    Melba's Jammin' Guest

    Default Re: cshenk: need help!

    In article <[email protected]>,
    Vesper <[email protected]> wrote:

    > On Sun, 28 Jun 2009 17:32:31 -0500, Melba's Jammin'
    > <[email protected]> wrote:
    > >Google "pizza stone." Never mind, read this:
    > >http://www.recipepizza.com/pizza_stone.htm
    > >
    > >I use 6" square, 1/4" thick unglazed terra cotta tiles. Dirt cheap and
    > >they work just swell. I use them with Zoe Francois and Jeff Hertzberg's
    > >"Artisan Bread in 5 Minutes a Day" recipes.

    >
    >
    > Thanks. I assume I preheat the tiles in the oven and then put the
    > dough on them.
    >
    > V


    You're welcome.
    Yes. Baking instructions usually cover that, I think. At least the
    recipe I use does. :-) Some people leave the baking stone in the oven
    all the time; I don't.

    --
    -Barb, Mother Superior, HOSSSPoJ
    http://web.me.com/barbschaller - good news 4-6-2009
    "Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle."
    -Philo of Alexandria

  18. #18
    Melba's Jammin' Guest

    Default Re: cshenk: need help!

    In article <[email protected]>,
    Vesper <[email protected]> wrote:
    (snip)
    > Thanks. I assume I preheat the tiles in the oven and then put the
    > dough on them.
    >
    > V


    I forgot to mention that I use parchment under my bread dough. It's
    just easier for me to get the loaf off the tiles.

    --
    -Barb, Mother Superior, HOSSSPoJ
    http://web.me.com/barbschaller - good news 4-6-2009
    "Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle."
    -Philo of Alexandria

  19. #19
    Vesper Guest

    Default Re: cshenk: need help!

    On Sun, 28 Jun 2009 20:34:04 -0500, Melba's Jammin'
    <barbschaller@earthl[email protected]> wrote:

    >In article <[email protected]>,
    > Vesper <[email protected]> wrote:
    >(snip)
    >> Thanks. I assume I preheat the tiles in the oven and then put the
    >> dough on them.
    >>
    >> V

    >
    >I forgot to mention that I use parchment under my bread dough. It's
    >just easier for me to get the loaf off the tiles.



    That answered my next question.

    Thanks.

    V

  20. #20
    sf Guest

    Default Re: cshenk: need help!

    On Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:13:03 -0500, Vesper <[email protected]> wrote:

    >On Sun, 28 Jun 2009 13:01:56 -0700, sf <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >>On Sun, 28 Jun 2009 12:02:50 -0500, Vesper <[email protected]> wrote:
    >>
    >>>Water spritzes I get. What's with the stone?

    >>
    >>For a crispier bottom crust

    >
    >
    >You mean you place the formed dough on some kind of big stone to bake
    >it? Does the stone have to be flat or something? What kind of stone
    >is best? Does it work in a campfire? I got some more but I want to
    >give you a breather.
    >
    >V


    Would it help any if I told you an alternate is to put it on an
    unglazed tile?

    --
    I love cooking with wine.
    Sometimes I even put it in the food.

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