-
Re: cholesterol
Mark Thorson wrote:
> Julie Bove wrote:
>> "John John" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>> Which ones are ok?
>> Coconut oil.
>
> Baloney. There are quack "diet" experts who claim coconut
> oil is healthful, but the scientific evidence is against
> them. They peddle this line because that's how you
> get notoriety in the diet field. You don't get famous
> by agreeing with mainstream medicine and peer-reviewed
> literature. You get famous by saying the conventional
> wisdom is wrong. Unfortunately, a lot of people are
> getting suckered into believing these crackpot theories.
>
> This study blames the MUCH higher rate of
> cardiovascular mortality in Singapore as compared
> to Hong Kong on consumption of saturated fats
> including coconut oil.
>
> Eur J Epidemiol. 2001;17(5):469-77.
> Differences in all-cause, cardiovascular and
> cancer mortality between Hong Kong and Singapore:
> role of nutrition.
> Zhang J, Kesteloot H.
> Department of Epidemiology, School of Public
> Health, Catholic University of Leuven, Belgium.
>
> BACKGROUND: The majority of inhabitants in Hong Kong
> and Singapore are ethnic Chinese, but all-cause and
> cardiovascular mortality rates in these two regions
> are markedly different. This study describes
> differences in the magnitude and trends in mortality
> and attempts to explain these differences.
>
> METHODS: Data of mortality rates in 1963-1965 and
> 1993-1995 in the age class of 45-74 years, dietary
> habits and other factors were compared between
> Hong Kong and Singapore using Japan, Spain and the USA
> as reference countries. Mortality and food consumption
> data were obtained from WHO and FAO, respectively.
>
> RESULTS: Large differences in all-cause and cardiovascular
> mortality exist between Hong Kong and Singapore. The
> difference in total cancer mortality was less consistent
> and smaller. The most pronounced finding was that ischemic
> heart disease mortality in 1993-1995 was 2.98 and 3.14 times
> higher in Singapore than in Hong Kong in men and women,
> respectively. Of the five countries considered, Singapore
> has the highest all-cause mortality in both sexes in the
> period of 1960-1995. The ratio of animal to vegetal fat
> was higher in Singapore (2.24) than in Hong Kong (1.08).
> Singapore had higher serum concentrations of total
> cholesterol and low-density lipoprotein cholesterol
> than Hong Kong, but the opposite result was observed
> for high-density lipoprotein cholesterol.
>
> CONCLUSIONS: There are striking differences in all-cause
> and cardiovascular mortality between Hong Kong and
> Singapore. These differences can be most reasonably and
> plausibly explained by their differences in dietary
> habits, for example, a higher consumption of coconut and
> palm oil, mainly containing saturated fat, in Singapore.
>
> [Coconut oil raises bad cholesterol more than
> beef fat!]
>
> Am J Clin Nutr. 1985 Aug;42(2):190-7.
> Plasma lipid and lipoprotein response of humans
> to beef fat, coconut oil and safflower oil.
> Reiser R, Probstfield JL, Silvers A, Scott LW,
> Shorney ML, Wood RD, O'Brien BC, Gotto AM Jr,
> Insull W Jr.
>
> This study's purpose was to evaluate the fasting
> human plasma lipid and lipoprotein responses to
> dietary beef fat (BF) by comparison with coconut
> oil (CO) and safflower oil (SO), fats customarily
> classified as saturated and polyunsaturated.
> Nineteen free-living normolipidemic men aged
> 25.6 +/- 3.5 yr consumed centrally-prepared
> lunches and dinners of common foods having 35%
> fat calories, 60% of which was the test fat.
> The test fats were isocalorically substituted,
> and each fed for five weeks in random sequences
> with intervening five weeks of habitual diets.
> Plasma total cholesterol (TC), high-density
> lipoprotein cholesterol (HDL-C), and low-density
> lipoprotein cholesterol (LDL-C) concentrations
> among individuals follows the same relative rank
> regardless of diet. Triglycerides (TG)
> concentrations among individuals also maintain
> their relative rank regardless of diet but in
> a different order from that of the cholesterols.
> Plasma TC, HDL-C, and LDL-C responses to BF were
> significantly lower and TG higher than to CO.
> As compared to SO, BF produced equivalent levels
> of TG, HDL-C, and LDL-C and marginally higher TC.
> Thus, the customary consideration of BF as
> "saturated" and grouping it with CO appears
> unwarranted.
>
> This study in a rat model for myocardial
> infarction (induced with a synthetic hormone)
> found omega-3 fatty acids to be protective
> against lipid peroxidation and cardiovascular
> death, while coconut oil raised indicators of
> damage to the heart muscle.
>
> J Nutr Biochem. 1999 Jun;10(6):338-44.
> Effect of saturated, omega-3 and omega-6
> polyunsaturated fatty acids on myocardial
> infarction.
> Nageswari K, Banerjee R, Menon VP.
> School of Biomedical Engineering, Indian
> Institute of Technology, Bombay, India.
>
> Dietary fatty acids have cholesterol lowering,
> antiatherogenic, and antiarrhythmic properties
> that decrease the risk of myocardial infarction (MI).
> This study was designed to study the effects of
> various oils rich in either polyunsaturated
> (omega-3 or omega-6) fatty acids (PUFA) or
> saturated fatty acids (SFA) on the severity of
> experimentally induced MI. Male albino Sprague-Dawley
> rats (100-150 g; n = 20) were fed diets enriched with
> fish oil (omega-3 PUFA), peanut oil (omega-6 PUFA),
> or coconut oil (SFA) for 60 days. Experimental MI was
> induced with isoproterenol. Mortality rates; serum
> enzymes aspartate amino transferase; alanine amino
> transferase; creatine phosphokinase (CPK); lipid
> profiles in serum, myocardium, and aorta; peroxide
> levels in heart and aorta; activities of catalase and
> superoxide dismutase; and levels of glutathione were
> measured. The results demonstrated that mortality rate,
> CPK levels, myocardial lipid peroxides, and glutathione
> levels were decreased in the omega-3 PUFA treated group.
> Maximum increase in parameters indicative of myocardial
> damage was seen in the coconut oil group. These findings
> suggest that dietary omega-3 PUFA offers maximum
> protection in experimentally induced MI in comparison
> to omega-6 PUFA and SFA enriched diets. SFA was found
> to have the least protective effect.
Those studies are rather old. What is the CURRENT thinking on
this matter?
--
-
Re: cholesterol
On Sunday, September 30, 2012 12:27:53 AM UTC-5, Reggie wrote:
> "Bryan" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]..
>
> On Sep 29, 7:07 pm, "Reggie" <Reg...@wantsnospam.com> wrote:
>
> > "Bryan" <bryangsimm...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> >
>
> > news:[email protected]..
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> > On Saturday, September 29, 2012 6:38:20 PM UTC-5, Reggie wrote:
>
> > > "Mark Thorson" <nos...@sonic.net> wrote in message
>
> >
>
> > >news:[email protected]..
>
> >
>
> > > > Dave Smith wrote:
>
> >
>
> > > >> On 29/09/2012 7:59 AM, Somebody wrote:
>
> >
>
> > > >> > "Julie Bove" <julieb...@frontier.com> wrote in message
>
> >
>
> > > >> >news:k4697u$1ek$[email protected]..
>
> >
>
> > > >> >>> Which ones are ok?
>
> >
>
> > > >> >> Coconut oil.
>
> >
>
> > > >> > egads! Even Mitt Romney would not make a joke like that.
>
> >
>
> > > >> The information booklet I got in cardiac rehab suggested eating lots
>
> > > >> of
>
> >
>
> > > >> fruit and vegetables, but in capitals it says ...NOT COCONUT. It is
>
> >
>
> > > >> apparently very high in cholesterol. When I asked about the claimsof
>
> >
>
> > > >> health benefits of the good cholesterol it was suggested that is hype
>
> >
>
> > > >> from the people selling it. IN my situation, I think I am better off
>
> >
>
> > > >> following the advice of the health professionals.
>
> >
>
> > > > Yes, coconut oil is even worse than beef fat
>
> >
>
> > > > and lard. It's being hyped by the "alternative
>
> >
>
> > > > medicine" crowd that rejects medical science.
>
> >
>
> > > but beef fat and lard are healthy. you need to stay current.
>
> >
>
> > No, they are not. They just aren't as relatively bad as once thought, but
>
> > that's not because they are good, but because the inflammatory effects of
>
> > polyunsaturates are more well understood. Beef fat and lard are high in
>
> > palmitic and myristic acids. Those are baddies.
>
> >
>
> > --Bryan
>
> >
>
> > their large component is oleic, a goodie.
>
>
>
> But there are sources of oleic that do not have the downside of being
>
> high in palmitic and myristic. On the upside, beef/pork fats are also
>
> high in stearic, and very low in polyunsaturates. I eat way more beef
>
> and pork fat than I figure is optimal because I love beef and bacon,
>
> and certain other pork products, but I do try to limit them. My
>
> saturated fat weakness is butterfat, which is even worse, but that I
>
> find totally delicious. There is some evidence that the bad saturated
>
> fats have less impact when consumed as part of a ketogenic diet
>
> regime. That makes sense because if ones body is optimized for
>
> converting fatty acids to ketones, then more fatty acids are
>
> indiscriminately broken down for fueling metabolism. Carb restriction
>
> certainly lowers plasma triglycerides.
>
>
>
> --Bryan
>
>
>
> ok, now that I think of it; where is there a table of fats/oils, listing
>
> components like stearic acid (rather than just saturated, mono, etc.)?
Just put the search terms into Wikipedia, Google, etc. and don't believe what I say without doing your own research. You will find that high oleic oils are healthful, and that stearic acid is a healthful thing, unlike some of the other saturated fatty acids.
--Bryan
-
Re: cholesterol
Bryan <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Sunday, September 30, 2012 12:27:53 AM UTC-5, Reggie wrote:
>> "Bryan" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>
>> news:[email protected]..
>>
>> On Sep 29, 7:07 pm, "Reggie" <Reg...@wantsnospam.com> wrote:
>>
>>> "Bryan" <bryangsimm...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>
>>>
>>
>>> news:[email protected]..
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>>
>>
>>> On Saturday, September 29, 2012 6:38:20 PM UTC-5, Reggie wrote:
>>
>>>> "Mark Thorson" <nos...@sonic.net> wrote in message
>>
>>>
>>
>>>> news:[email protected]..
>>
>>>
>>
>>>>> Dave Smith wrote:
>>
>>>
>>
>>>>>> On 29/09/2012 7:59 AM, Somebody wrote:
>>
>>>
>>
>>>>>>> "Julie Bove" <julieb...@frontier.com> wrote in message
>>
>>>
>>
>>>>>>> news:k4697u$1ek$[email protected]..
>>
>>>
>>
>>>>>>>>> Which ones are ok?
>>
>>>
>>
>>>>>>>> Coconut oil.
>>
>>>
>>
>>>>>>> egads! Even Mitt Romney would not make a joke like that.
>>
>>>
>>
>>>>>> The information booklet I got in cardiac rehab suggested eating lots
>>
>>>>>> of
>>
>>>
>>
>>>>>> fruit and vegetables, but in capitals it says ...NOT COCONUT. It is
>>
>>>
>>
>>>>>> apparently very high in cholesterol. When I asked about the claims of
>>
>>>
>>
>>>>>> health benefits of the good cholesterol it was suggested that is hype
>>
>>>
>>
>>>>>> from the people selling it. IN my situation, I think I am better off
>>
>>>
>>
>>>>>> following the advice of the health professionals.
>>
>>>
>>
>>>>> Yes, coconut oil is even worse than beef fat
>>
>>>
>>
>>>>> and lard. It's being hyped by the "alternative
>>
>>>
>>
>>>>> medicine" crowd that rejects medical science.
>>
>>>
>>
>>>> but beef fat and lard are healthy. you need to stay current.
>>
>>>
>>
>>> No, they are not. They just aren't as relatively bad as once thought, but
>>
>>> that's not because they are good, but because the inflammatory effects of
>>
>>> polyunsaturates are more well understood. Beef fat and lard are high in
>>
>>> palmitic and myristic acids. Those are baddies.
>>
>>>
>>
>>> --Bryan
>>
>>>
>>
>>> their large component is oleic, a goodie.
>>
>>
>>
>> But there are sources of oleic that do not have the downside of being
>>
>> high in palmitic and myristic. On the upside, beef/pork fats are also
>>
>> high in stearic, and very low in polyunsaturates. I eat way more beef
>>
>> and pork fat than I figure is optimal because I love beef and bacon,
>>
>> and certain other pork products, but I do try to limit them. My
>>
>> saturated fat weakness is butterfat, which is even worse, but that I
>>
>> find totally delicious. There is some evidence that the bad saturated
>>
>> fats have less impact when consumed as part of a ketogenic diet
>>
>> regime. That makes sense because if ones body is optimized for
>>
>> converting fatty acids to ketones, then more fatty acids are
>>
>> indiscriminately broken down for fueling metabolism. Carb restriction
>>
>> certainly lowers plasma triglycerides.
>>
>>
>>
>> --Bryan
>>
>>
>>
>> ok, now that I think of it; where is there a table of fats/oils, listing
>>
>> components like stearic acid (rather than just saturated, mono, etc.)?
>
> Just put the search terms into Wikipedia, Google, etc. and don't believe
> what I say without doing your own research. You will find that high
> oleic oils are healthful, and that stearic acid is a healthful thing,
> unlike some of the other saturated fatty acids.
>
> --Bryan
They can also be useful in making a good electrical contact cleaner. Oleic
acid.
Greg
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