Thread: Boiling water question

Kalmia <[email protected]> wrote:

>I have heard that cold water will come to a boil quicker than warm
>water. Not having identical pots and burners, I am at a lost to test
>this. Any truth to this, and if so, why?

It can be true. It is related to convection effects around the
container of water. Food science writers (Magee, Steingarten)
have addressed these kind of claims and they are not entirely
fictional.

Steve

"Steve Pope" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:iu0mqe$5sg$[email protected]..
> Kalmia <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>I have heard that cold water will come to a boil quicker than warm
>>water. Not having identical pots and burners, I am at a lost to test
>>this. Any truth to this, and if so, why?
>
> It can be true. It is related to convection effects around the
> container of water. Food science writers (Magee, Steingarten)
> have addressed these kind of claims and they are not entirely
> fictional.
>
> Steve

Just in case you were thinking of using water from your hot water tank for
cooking because it 'may' be faster, I'm not so sure that's a good idea.
Polly

On 2011-06-23, Kalmia <[email protected]> wrote:
> I have heard that cold water will come to a boil quicker than warm
> water.

I've heard there such things as trolls. Do you have **** fer brains
or are you jes low grade troll?

nb

On Thu, 23 Jun 2011 20:15:00 -0500, "Polly Esther"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>
>"Steve Pope" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:iu0mqe$5sg$[email protected]..
>> Kalmia <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>>I have heard that cold water will come to a boil quicker than warm
>>>water. Not having identical pots and burners, I am at a lost to test
>>>this. Any truth to this, and if so, why?
>>
>> It can be true. It is related to convection effects around the
>> container of water. Food science writers (Magee, Steingarten)
>> have addressed these kind of claims and they are not entirely
>> fictional.
>>
>> Steve
>
>Just in case you were thinking of using water from your hot water tank for
>cooking because it 'may' be faster, I'm not so sure that's a good idea.
>Polly

I think the original claim was that hot water froze faster than cold
water. The ostensible reason was that cold water contained dissolved
gases that had to undergo phase-changes, which delayed freezing. OTOH,
hot water was already de-gassed, and chilled faster, not being delayed
by the phase change situation. Practical value to the homemaker? Nil.

Alex

On 6/23/2011 3:26 PM, Chemiker wrote:
> On Thu, 23 Jun 2011 20:15:00 -0500, "Polly Esther"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>
>> "Steve Pope"<[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:iu0mqe$5sg$[email protected]..
>>> Kalmia<[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I have heard that cold water will come to a boil quicker than warm
>>>> water. Not having identical pots and burners, I am at a lost to test
>>>> this. Any truth to this, and if so, why?
>>>
>>> It can be true. It is related to convection effects around the
>>> container of water. Food science writers (Magee, Steingarten)
>>> have addressed these kind of claims and they are not entirely
>>> fictional.
>>>
>>> Steve
>>
>> Just in case you were thinking of using water from your hot water tank for
>> cooking because it 'may' be faster, I'm not so sure that's a good idea.
>> Polly
>
> I think the original claim was that hot water froze faster than cold
> water. The ostensible reason was that cold water contained dissolved
> gases that had to undergo phase-changes, which delayed freezing. OTOH,
> hot water was already de-gassed, and chilled faster, not being delayed
> by the phase change situation. Practical value to the homemaker? Nil.
>
> Alex

Water that has been boiled a couple of times may or may not freeze
faster than water that has not been boiled provided that they start off
at the same temperature. Boiling water and cooling it is supposed to
provide clear icecubes when frozen because the dissolved gases have been
removed. My guess is that setting water in a container under a strong
vacuum might be the better way to go if you want to de-gas water.

Whenever I have to boil water, I always start with the hottest tap water
I have. When filling ice cube trays, I'll always use cold tap water. To
do otherwise would be a waste of energy.

On Thu, 23 Jun 2011 16:14:10 -0700 (PDT), Kalmia
<[email protected]> wrote:

>I have heard that cold water will come to a boil quicker than warm
>water. Not having identical pots and burners, I am at a lost to test
>this. Any truth to this, and if so, why?

If you think about the process, it can't be true.

When heating cold water, on it's way to being hot water, it passes
through being warm water.

Cold to warm to hot.

Warm to hot would exclude the time it takes to go from cold to warm,
thus making it faster then starting with cold.

The one where warm water freezes faster than cold water is the same
process in reverse.

Warm water has to pass through cold on its way to freezing.

Those old myths are kinda funny.

On 23/06/2011 11:08 PM, Mark Thorson wrote:
> dsi1 wrote:
>>
>> Whenever I have to boil water, I always start with the hottest tap water
>> I have. When filling ice cube trays, I'll always use cold tap water. To
>> do otherwise would be a waste of energy.
>
> I remember reading something included in my
> gas/electricity bill that said the opposite,
> you save energy by boiling cold water.

That is probably because you have to run the hot water for a while to
purge the line of cold water before you get to the hot stuff, which is a
waste of water that has been previously heated, so a considerable waste
of energy. The heater on the water tank may not cycle on every time you
do that, but will do it frequently,and that is going to cause you to
heat up a lot more water in the tank than you are likely to be heating
up in your pot.

Remember that it takes a certain amount of heat to raise the temperature
of a given volume of water. The more water you are heating and the
greater the difference in temperature, the more heat it is going to
take. It is going to take less time and energy to bring hot water to a
boil than cold, but you are guaranteed to be wasting a lot more energy.

"Landon" <> wrote

> On Thu, 23 Jun 2011 16:14:10 -0700 (PDT), Kalmia
> <> wrote:
>
>>I have heard that cold water will come to a boil quicker than warm
>>water. Not having identical pots and burners, I am at a lost to test
>>this. Any truth to this, and if so, why?
>
> If you think about the process, it can't be true.
>
> When heating cold water, on it's way to being hot water, it passes
> through being warm water.
>
> Cold to warm to hot.
>
> Warm to hot would exclude the time it takes to go from cold to warm,
> thus making it faster then starting with cold.
>
> The one where warm water freezes faster than cold water is the same
> process in reverse.
>
> Warm water has to pass through cold on its way to freezing.
>
> Those old myths are kinda funny.

But this is our own little cooking show. Why are we boiling water? Are we
going to use it to sterillize the garden shovel or are we using it for
cooking? If cooking, cold water would likely be preferable to something
that's been sitting around in a hot water tank. Ever drain your hot water
tank? Polly
>

dsi1 wrote:
>
> Whenever I have to boil water, I always start with the hottest tap water
> I have. When filling ice cube trays, I'll always use cold tap water. To
> do otherwise would be a waste of energy.

I remember reading something included in my
gas/electricity bill that said the opposite,
you save energy by boiling cold water.

Polly Esther wrote:
> "Landon" <> wrote
>
>> On Thu, 23 Jun 2011 16:14:10 -0700 (PDT), Kalmia
>> <> wrote:
>>
>>> I have heard that cold water will come to a boil quicker than warm
>>> water. Not having identical pots and burners, I am at a lost to
>>> test this. Any truth to this, and if so, why?
>>
>> If you think about the process, it can't be true.
>>
>> When heating cold water, on it's way to being hot water, it passes
>> through being warm water.
>>
>> Cold to warm to hot.
>>
>> Warm to hot would exclude the time it takes to go from cold to warm,
>> thus making it faster then starting with cold.
>>
>> The one where warm water freezes faster than cold water is the same
>> process in reverse.
>>
>> Warm water has to pass through cold on its way to freezing.
>>
>> Those old myths are kinda funny.
>
> But this is our own little cooking show. Why are we boiling water?
> Are we going to use it to sterillize the garden shovel or are we
> using it for cooking? If cooking, cold water would likely be
> preferable to something that's been sitting around in a hot water
> tank.

Yes, I've thought of that. I don't use hot water to make tea, but I
don't think it makes all that much difference if I'm trying to make the
kids spaghetti.

> Ever drain your hot water tank? Polly

If you've run out of hot water while taking a shower, wouldn't that mean
you'd drained the tank?

-S-

"Kalmia" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]..
>I have heard that cold water will come to a boil quicker than warm
> water. Not having identical pots and burners, I am at a lost to test
> this. Any truth to this, and if so, why?

No matter how you try to change the laws of physics youi cannot. Water
boils only afetr a speciofic amount of energy has been applied to it. This
energy is measured in calories. 1 calorie will raise 1 gram of water 1
degree Celsius. Also, it takes 540 calories to turn 1 gram of water (at 100
degrees C) to steam. The closer your are to 100C to start with the less
energy you will need to boil the water.

Paul

"Polly Esther" <[email protected]> wrote

>
> But this is our own little cooking show. Why are we boiling water? Are
> we going to use it to sterillize the garden shovel or are we using it for
> cooking? If cooking, cold water would likely be preferable to something
> that's been sitting around in a hot water tank. Ever drain your hot water
> tank? Polly
>>
>

Not to mention that you paid to heat it anyway so there is no savings on the
range. Some hot water tanks can give an off taste from mineral sediment, as
Polly points out.

On Thu, 23 Jun 2011 20:15:00 -0500, "Polly Esther" <[email protected]> wrote:

>
>"Steve Pope" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:iu0mqe$5sg$[email protected]..
>> Kalmia <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>>I have heard that cold water will come to a boil quicker than warm
>>>water. Not having identical pots and burners, I am at a lost to test
>>>this. Any truth to this, and if so, why?
>>
>> It can be true. It is related to convection effects around the
>> container of water. Food science writers (Magee, Steingarten)
>> have addressed these kind of claims and they are not entirely
>> fictional.
>>
>> Steve
>
>Just in case you were thinking of using water from your hot water tank for
>cooking because it 'may' be faster, I'm not so sure that's a good idea.

AND there is the fact that SOME PEOPLE will believe ANYTHING!

You have a certain amount of energy to heat the water (stove or microwave).

The colder the water is, the LONGER it will take to heat,
UNLESS you use MORE energy to do the heating.

THAQT is simple physics!

Kalmia wrote:
> I have heard that cold water will come to a boil quicker than warm
> water. Not having identical pots and burners, I am at a lost to test
> this. Any truth to this, and if so, why?

I don't think so. If that were so, why do they make Insinkerators?

Polly Esther wrote:
> "Steve Pope" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:iu0mqe$5sg$[email protected]..
>> Kalmia <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> I have heard that cold water will come to a boil quicker than warm
>>> water. Not having identical pots and burners, I am at a lost to
>>> test this. Any truth to this, and if so, why?
>>
>> It can be true. It is related to convection effects around the
>> container of water. Food science writers (Magee, Steingarten)
>> have addressed these kind of claims and they are not entirely
>> fictional.
>>
>> Steve
>
> Just in case you were thinking of using water from your hot water
> tank for cooking because it 'may' be faster, I'm not so sure that's a
> good idea. Polly

I know they used to say this because lead was more likely to leach from the
pipes. But if you have a house with PVC pipes like I do, this probably
isn't true.

When I want to clean my microwave, I start with hot water and it comes to a
boil super fast.

On Jun 23, 5:08*pm, Mark Thorson <nos...@sonic.net> wrote:
> dsi1 wrote:
>
> > Whenever I have to boil water, I always start with the hottest tap water
> > I have. When filling ice cube trays, I'll always use cold tap water. To
> > do otherwise would be a waste of energy.
>
> I remember reading something included in my
> gas/electricity bill that said the opposite,
> you save energy by boiling cold water.

You might be right about this. OTOH, if I can save a few minutes to
boil some water, I guess that it might be worth a few tiny watts.
Anything to get me out of the kitchen fast! (-:

On Jun 23, 10:16*pm, "Steve Freides" <st...@kbnj.com> wrote:
> Polly Esther wrote:
>
>
> > Ever drain your hot water tank? Polly
>
> If you've run out of hot water while taking a shower, wouldn't that mean
> you'd drained the tank?
>
> -S-
>
>
No, it's not.

In article <[email protected]>,
ItsJoanNotJoann <[email protected]> wrote:
>On Jun 23, 10:16*pm, "Steve Freides" <st...@kbnj.com> wrote:
>> Polly Esther wrote:
>>
>>
>> > Ever drain your hot water tank? Polly
>>
>> If you've run out of hot water while taking a shower, wouldn't that mean
>> you'd drained the tank?
>>
>> -S-
>>
>>
>No, it's not.

In Britain the hot water tanks empty out as you use hot water.
At least, that was true in previous decades, maybe they have
changed.


S.

Steve Pope wrote:
> In article
> <[email protected]>,
> ItsJoanNotJoann <[email protected]> wrote:
>> On Jun 23, 10:16 pm, "Steve Freides" <st...@kbnj.com> wrote:
>>> Polly Esther wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> Ever drain your hot water tank? Polly
>>>
>>> If you've run out of hot water while taking a shower, wouldn't that
>>> mean you'd drained the tank?
>>>
>>> -S-
>>>
>>>
>> No, it's not.
>
> In Britain the hot water tanks empty out as you use hot water.
> At least, that was true in previous decades, maybe they have
> changed.

I don't think that's how they work here, but I could be wrong.