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Thread: Sticker shock

  1. #1
    Mark Lipton Guest

    Default Sticker shock

    My Burgundy epiphany arrived in the form of the '88 Dujac Clos de la
    Roche, which we purchased at the first HDH auction in 2004 as part of a
    mixed case of '88 GCs (total cost $550 + vig for the case). Today, I
    received the latest HDH auction catalogue in which that same '88 Dujac
    Clos de la Roche is now priced at $300-450 a _bottle_! The only
    silver lining is a graphic at the beginning of the catalogue showing an
    overall decline in auction prices over the past year. Perhaps we can
    dub that the "Rudy Kurniawan effect"? ;-)

    Mark Lipton

  2. #2
    Bi!! Guest

    Default Re: Sticker shock

    On Aug 29, 11:52*pm, Mark Lipton <not...@eudrup.ude> wrote:
    > My Burgundy epiphany arrived in the form of the '88 Dujac Clos de la
    > Roche, which we purchased at the first HDH auction in 2004 as part of a
    > mixed case of '88 GCs (total cost $550 + vig for the case). *Today, I
    > received the latest HDH auction catalogue in which that same '88 Dujac
    > Clos de la Roche is now priced at $300-450 a _bottle_! *The only
    > silver lining is a graphic at the beginning of the catalogue showing an
    > overall decline in auction prices over the past year. *Perhaps we can
    > dub that the "Rudy Kurniawan effect"? ;-)
    >
    > Mark Lipton


    I feel your pain Mark. I bought a ton of Burgundy a few years ago so
    I haven't been in the market recently and I was shocked by the prices
    I'm seeing on HDH, Acker, etc including the prices on a number of
    private sites where cellars are being liquidated privately. Burgundy
    has gone insane. I did however just receive an e-mail yesterday
    selling nothing but SQN with a number of wines at $150 which is a
    downturn from the $300-$400 that these wines have been sold at
    recently.

  3. #3
    DaleW Guest

    Default Re: Sticker shock

    On Wednesday, August 29, 2012 11:52:07 PM UTC-4, Mark Lipton wrote:
    > My Burgundy epiphany arrived in the form of the '88 Dujac Clos de la
    >
    > Roche, which we purchased at the first HDH auction in 2004 as part of a
    >
    > mixed case of '88 GCs (total cost $550 + vig for the case). Today, I
    >
    > received the latest HDH auction catalogue in which that same '88 Dujac
    >
    > Clos de la Roche is now priced at $300-450 a _bottle_! The only
    >
    > silver lining is a graphic at the beginning of the catalogue showing an
    >
    > overall decline in auction prices over the past year. Perhaps we can
    >
    > dub that the "Rudy Kurniawan effect"? ;-)
    >
    >
    >
    > Mark Lipton


    Yeah, lots of stuff that I used to be able to afford- no longer!

    I will point out a couple of other factors than general rises:

    Dujac - already borderline cult-I'd guess the CdlR was the most expensive bottle in that mixed case? - has gotten even more popular since 2004.

    1988 really languished in market for a lot of years as they're on austere side, and were shut down hard. Parker rated them mediocre to poor. But as they've begun drinking (much) better - and the comments on wine boards and by critics like Meadows and Gilman who have a better grip on Burgundy are much more positive- prices have creeped up even more than other vintages. As a fan of the vintage this makes me sad!

    Those are just observations, I totally agree re Burg prices overall


  4. #4
    Mark Lipton Guest

    Default Re: Sticker shock

    On 8/30/12 10:10 AM, DaleW wrote:

    >
    > Yeah, lots of stuff that I used to be able to afford- no longer!
    >
    > I will point out a couple of other factors than general rises:
    >
    > Dujac - already borderline cult-I'd guess the CdlR was the most
    > expensive bottle in that mixed case? - has gotten even more popular
    > since 2004.
    >
    > 1988 really languished in market for a lot of years as they're on
    > austere side, and were shut down hard. Parker rated them mediocre to
    > poor. But as they've begun drinking (much) better - and the comments
    > on wine boards and by critics like Meadows and Gilman who have a
    > better grip on Burgundy are much more positive- prices have creeped
    > up even more than other vintages. As a fan of the vintage this makes
    > me sad!
    >
    > Those are just observations, I totally agree re Burg prices overall
    >



    Good points, Dale. I have no idea if Dujac was the most expensive in
    the case, but probably (the rest IIRC were Faiveley and Roty GCs -
    Chambertin Clos de Bez, Mazis-Chambertin, etc, and multiple bottles of
    Chevillon Vaucrains). And of course this effect isn't limited to
    Burgundy. Bdx, CalCabs and Rhone wines have all undergone similar price
    escalation.

    Mark Lipton
    --
    alt.food.wine FAQ: http://winefaq.cwdjr.net

  5. #5
    cwdjrxyz Guest

    Default Re: Sticker shock

    On Aug 31, 12:25*pm, Mark Lipton <not...@eudrup.ude> wrote:
    > On 8/30/12 10:10 AM, DaleW wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > > Yeah, lots of stuff that I used to be able to afford- no longer!

    >
    > > I will point out a couple of other factors than general rises:

    >
    > > Dujac - already borderline cult-I'd guess the CdlR was the most
    > > expensive bottle in that mixed case? - *has gotten even more popular
    > > since 2004.

    >
    > > 1988 really languished in market for a lot of years as they're on
    > > austere side, and were shut down hard. Parker rated them mediocre to
    > > poor. *But as they've begun drinking (much) better - and the comments
    > > on wine boards and by critics like Meadows and Gilman who have a
    > > better grip on Burgundy are much more positive- prices have creeped
    > > up even more than other vintages. As a fan of the vintage this makes
    > > me sad!

    >
    > > Those are just observations, I totally agree re Burg prices overall

    >
    > Good points, Dale. *I have no idea if Dujac was the most expensive in
    > the case, but probably (the rest IIRC were Faiveley and Roty GCs -
    > Chambertin Clos de Bez, Mazis-Chambertin, etc, and multiple bottles of
    > Chevillon Vaucrains). *And of course this effect isn't limited to
    > Burgundy. *Bdx, CalCabs and Rhone wines have all undergone similar price
    > escalation.


    I just received an offer from FinestWine for a few wines. All prices
    are listed in Euros per bottle. Also there are shipping charges for
    orders under 600 Euros. In the EU one must also pay about 19% VAT.

    Petrus 1990 (a Parker 100/100 wine) - 2990;
    Petrus 1971 - 1600;
    Petrus 1995 - 1490;
    Vega Sicilia Unico 1922 - 1600;
    Lafite-Rothschild 1975 - 650;

    I bought a case of the 1971 Petrus in the mid 1970s for around US$30
    per bottle and still have 9 bottles that have been stored properly. I
    guess I will have to get along with that, considering the prices given
    above. I have a few bottles of the 1975 Lafite, and it has not
    impressed me much. If I were buying it now, I can think of many other
    ways I could spend 650 Euros that would bring more pleasure.


  6. #6
    Mark Lipton Guest

    Default Re: Sticker shock

    cwdjrxyz wrote:

    > I just received an offer from FinestWine for a few wines. All prices
    > are listed in Euros per bottle. Also there are shipping charges for
    > orders under 600 Euros. In the EU one must also pay about 19% VAT.
    >
    > Petrus 1990 (a Parker 100/100 wine) - 2990;
    > Petrus 1971 - 1600;
    > Petrus 1995 - 1490;
    > Vega Sicilia Unico 1922 - 1600;
    > Lafite-Rothschild 1975 - 650;
    >
    > I bought a case of the 1971 Petrus in the mid 1970s for around US$30
    > per bottle and still have 9 bottles that have been stored properly. I
    > guess I will have to get along with that, considering the prices given
    > above. I have a few bottles of the 1975 Lafite, and it has not
    > impressed me much. If I were buying it now, I can think of many other
    > ways I could spend 650 Euros that would bring more pleasure.
    >


    Depending on your own interests, you could consider selling those wines
    on the aftermarket to fund the purchase of other wines that you might
    enjoy more. IIRC, Dale has some experience with that '75 Lafite and
    came to a similar conclusion as you.

    Mark Lipton

  7. #7
    DaleW Guest

    Default Re: Sticker shock

    On Sunday, September 2, 2012 4:16:34 PM UTC-4, Mark Lipton wrote:
    > cwdjrxyz wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    > > I just received an offer from FinestWine for a few wines. All prices

    >
    > > are listed in Euros per bottle. Also there are shipping charges for

    >
    > > orders under 600 Euros. In the EU one must also pay about 19% VAT.

    >
    > >

    >
    > > Petrus 1990 (a Parker 100/100 wine) - 2990;

    >
    > > Petrus 1971 - 1600;

    >
    > > Petrus 1995 - 1490;

    >
    > > Vega Sicilia Unico 1922 - 1600;

    >
    > > Lafite-Rothschild 1975 - 650;

    >
    > >

    >
    > > I bought a case of the 1971 Petrus in the mid 1970s for around US$30

    >
    > > per bottle and still have 9 bottles that have been stored properly. I

    >
    > > guess I will have to get along with that, considering the prices given

    >
    > > above. I have a few bottles of the 1975 Lafite, and it has not

    >
    > > impressed me much. If I were buying it now, I can think of many other

    >
    > > ways I could spend 650 Euros that would bring more pleasure.

    >
    > >

    >
    >
    >
    > Depending on your own interests, you could consider selling those wines
    >
    > on the aftermarket to fund the purchase of other wines that you might
    >
    > enjoy more. IIRC, Dale has some experience with that '75 Lafite and
    >
    > came to a similar conclusion as you.
    >
    >
    >
    > Mark Lipton


    I like the 75 Lafite, but it's certainly not a topflight first. And definitely not worth that kind of coin. Though this isn't apparently a bargain seller- WMJ lists average as $450, and that includes all premiums.
    I've only sold wines where a friend really wanted a wine. But if I had 1975 Lafite and thought I could clear $350, I'd be tempted.

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