Thread: The new Duval-Leroy Champagne Stopper

pavane wrote:
> http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/lif...cle6229181.ece
>
> This article discusses the new plastic Champagne stopper apparently
> now in use. Has anyone experienced these? They seem to be crown
> caps with an integrated handle which, fortunately, can still be sabered.

"Saberability" would depend on the neck of the bottle. Crown caps fit on
existing Champagne bottles, so should be no problem.

I have not heard of screw caps being contemplated for Champagne, is
there a Stelvin for champs?

--
Mike Tommasi - Six Fours, France
email link http://www.tommasi.org/mymail

Mike Tommasi <[email protected]> wrote:

> I have not heard of screw caps being contemplated for Champagne,
> is there a Stelvin for champs?

YES for transvasés miniatures. Definitely NO for bottle fermented
sparklers: disgorgment impossible.

Here in Austria, you can see quite a lot of semi-sparklers
("Perlwein" = frizzante). Bottle fermented examples carry crown
caps, tank fermented and those with added CO2 have screw-caps.

M.

"pavane" <[email protected]> wrote:

> http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/lif...d_and_drink/ar
> ticle6229181.ece
>
> This article discusses the new plastic Champagne stopper
> apparently now in use. Has anyone experienced these?

Of course not, since it was presented to the press only on May 6
in Paris (and these days in London).

> They seem to be crown caps with an integrated handle which,
> fortunately, can still be sabered.

Sabering is not something I would give a second of thought.

Otoh, may I cite from the article:

| Bruno de Saizieu, Alcan’s commercial director, said: “At first
| we tried a screw top but found that the symbolic noise was not
| there. It was our priority to keep this specific and evocative
| sound of champagne opening.”

Conventional screw tops and classic disgorgment is a no-no, of
course.

Otoh, maybe he had thought of a screw top crown cap as we have seen
for beer for some time now. But then I am not sure about the pressure
resistance, since chmapagne has a much higher internal CO2 pressure.

Again:

| Bernard Burtschy, a columnist for the Revue des Vins de France,
| said that he was worried by the health aspects of a polymer
| plastic seal inside the cap in contact with the wine, as well
| as the effect on taste. He predicted that bubbles would escape.

I know Bernard quite well, but this is absolutely ridiculous.
Plastic inserts ("bidule") inside the crown caps used during
second fermentation have been used for ages -- and believe me:
no bubble escape, taste nor health problems!

M.

"pavane" <[email protected]> wrote:

> They seem to be crown caps with an integrated handle which,
> fortunately, can still be sabered.

There is a good video from the presentation. It's indeed a crown
cap with handle:

<http://de.video.yahoo.com/watch/5014669/13339694?v=5014669>

M.

"Michael Pronay" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]..
| "pavane" <[email protected]> wrote:
|
| > They seem to be crown caps with an integrated handle which,
| > fortunately, can still be sabered.
|
| There is a good video from the presentation. It's indeed a crown
| cap with handle:
|
| <http://de.video.yahoo.com/watch/5014669/13339694?v=5014669>
|
| M.

Thank you for having found that video. It all looks like fun, which
of course Champagne ought to be.

pavane

Hi Michael,

On Mon, 11 May 2009 08:43:54 +0200, Michael Pronay <[email protected]>
wrote:


>| Bernard Burtschy, a columnist for the Revue des Vins de France,
>| said that he was worried by the health aspects of a polymer
>| plastic seal inside the cap in contact with the wine, as well
>| as the effect on taste. He predicted that bubbles would escape.

Ah yes, BB,, he who answered the question "What is Sekt"? with "The
name given to bad quality sparkling wine in Germany".

>I know Bernard quite well, but this is absolutely ridiculous.

I think he has a very good palate, but everything I've ever seen him
write and say publicly is franco-centredly chauvinist to a degree that
makes the UKIP seem like dangerous Europhiles.

>Plastic inserts ("bidule") inside the crown caps used during
>second fermentation have been used for ages -- and believe me:
>no bubble escape, taste nor health problems!

Has he conveniently forgotten that all champagne is aged under crown
stoppers, some for up to 25 years or more?

Deary me.
--
All the best
Fatty from Forges

"pavane" <[email protected]> wrote:

> | > They seem to be crown caps with an integrated handle which,
> | > fortunately, can still be sabered.
> |
> | There is a good video from the presentation. It's indeed a
> | crown cap with handle:
> |
> | <http://de.video.yahoo.com/watch/5014669/13339694?v=5014669>
> |
> | M.
>
> Thank you for having found that video. It all looks like fun,
> which of course Champagne ought to be.

You're welcome!

M. (Sorry for being late, but I just finished our largest annual
blind tasting, grouping nearly 1,700 Austrian wines.)

On 2009-06-12 01:06:49 -0700, Michael Pronay <[email protected]> said:

> "pavane" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> | > They seem to be crown caps with an integrated handle which,
>> | > fortunately, can still be sabered.
>> |
>> | There is a good video from the presentation. It's indeed a
>> | crown cap with handle:
>> |
>> | <http://de.video.yahoo.com/watch/5014669/13339694?v=5014669>
>> |
>> | M.
>>
>> Thank you for having found that video. It all looks like fun,
>> which of course Champagne ought to be.
>
> You're welcome!
>
> M. (Sorry for being late, but I just finished our largest annual
> blind tasting, grouping nearly 1,700 Austrian wines.)

So, what is wrong with the plastic "champagne corks" like used in some
less expensive California sparkelers which these levered crown caps
fix???

J

Ronin <[email protected]> wrote:

> So, what is wrong with the plastic "champagne corks" like used
> in some less expensive California sparkelers which these levered
> crown caps fix?

Caution, I dont quite get your question.

If you are talking about all-plastic corks that look like real
corks under the foil, they have a well known inconveniency: The
don't keep the CO2 pressure in the long run. After a year or two,
there's not much bubbles left.

If you are talking about the "Maestro" thing from Alcan, there is
a plastic insert in the crown cap, known as "bidule" in France and
always used for second fermentation in the bottle. But the
pressure tightness (over decades) is assured by the crown cap, not
by the bidule.

M.

Michael Pronay wrote:
> Ronin <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> So, what is wrong with the plastic "champagne corks" like used
>> in some less expensive California sparkelers which these levered
>> crown caps fix?
>
> Caution, I dont quite get your question.
>
> If you are talking about all-plastic corks that look like real
> corks under the foil, they have a well known inconveniency: The
> don't keep the CO2 pressure in the long run. After a year or two,
> there's not much bubbles left.
>
> If you are talking about the "Maestro" thing from Alcan, there is
> a plastic insert in the crown cap, known as "bidule" in France and
> always used for second fermentation in the bottle. But the
> pressure tightness (over decades) is assured by the crown cap, not
> by the bidule.

I /think/ he's talking about polyethylene "corks" that have a shape
similar to the real thing, and are similarly secured by a wire. They are
not the same as the plastic corks in still wines, because they are
hollow (since polyethylene is much more dense). The procedure for
opening them is the same as opening the real thing - you remove the
wire, and then coax the "cork" off. (It will pop and fly away - or not -
depending on your skill.) I don't really remember what they look like on
the cheap California bubblies (I've opened such a couple of times), but
I'm pretty sure that's what they looked like on commie-time Eastern
European "champagnes" - mostly Soviet and Bulgarian.

--
You'd be crazy to e-mail me with the crazy. But leave the div alone.

Patok <[email protected]> wrote:

>>> So, what is wrong with the plastic "champagne corks" like used
>>> in some less expensive California sparkelers which these
>>> levered crown caps fix?

>> If you are talking about all-plastic corks that look like real
>> corks under the foil, they have a well known inconveniency: The
>> don't keep the CO2 pressure in the long run. After a year or
>> two, there's not much bubbles left.

> I /think/ he's talking about polyethylene "corks" that have a
> shape similar to the real thing, and are similarly secured by a
> wire.

Thank you. That's what I was talking about. Sparklers
closed with these have a very limited shelf life. They're
ok for early-to-drink cheapos, but definitely a no-go for
better stuff.

Btw, you can find them not only in Calfornia and Eastern Europe,
but in Germany, Italy and Austria as well.

M.

On 2009-06-13 04:55:50 -0700, Michael Pronay <[email protected]> said:

> Patok <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>>> So, what is wrong with the plastic "champagne corks" like used
>>>> in some less expensive California sparkelers which these
>>>> levered crown caps fix?
>
>>> If you are talking about all-plastic corks that look like real
>>> corks under the foil, they have a well known inconveniency: The
>>> don't keep the CO2 pressure in the long run. After a year or
>>> two, there's not much bubbles left.
>
>> I /think/ he's talking about polyethylene "corks" that have a
>> shape similar to the real thing, and are similarly secured by a
>> wire.
>
> Thank you. That's what I was talking about. Sparklers
> closed with these have a very limited shelf life. They're
> ok for early-to-drink cheapos, but definitely a no-go for
> better stuff.
>
> Btw, you can find them not only in Calfornia and Eastern Europe,
> but in Germany, Italy and Austria as well.
>
> M.

Yup, that was what I was talking about, and I had no idea that they
didn't keep the pressure in for long. I'm going to have to stick a
couple of bottles of Korbel away for a few years to test it for
myself...